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Author Topic:   About the ability to change the size of formations (Moggy, Andy)
DOM
Member

From: Lille, France
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 02-22-2002 07:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for DOM     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hello,

What's new ? By chance, did you find time to study the bytes I mentioned in another post ?

Well, I found myself time (and courage) to study those bytes last night and it looks very promising IMHO. I will make some further investigations on Sunday and I will send you my own report.

From what I know now : the bytes are organized into 15 series of 3 x 16 bytes. I precisely know what are the aircraft whose formations are affected by those bytes. From memory (I am at work now), I can say that some series (I remember series 2, 3, 4, 10 and 15) are unused. All the others affect the formations of one to 10 aircraft. For example, the series #1 code for both B17 and B24. As I presumed in my first post, byte #3 of every chunk directly affects the size of every section of a formation and the size of the formation and its whole.

The way the program use those bytes #3 :
- the number of planes in a section (box) is byte #3 of the first chunk multiplied by the byte #3 of the second chunk.
- the max number of planes in a formation is the factor of the bytes #3 of the three chunks.

For example (and from memory), the V1 bytes #3 (series #8) are respectively 1, 1 and 3. That means a section size of 1 (1*1) and a total number of V1 per formation of 3 (1*1*3). That's also true for the other a/c.

The other bytes affect the position of every aircraft in a section and the position of every section in a formation but I still don't know how they work exactly. In the particular case of V1, almost all bytes are set to zero that leads to a random formation.

This is very promising and, in the future, I could make some kind of "formation randomizer" which will change those bytes in the exe. This could be included in a new version of my skin randomizer.

Cheers.

Dominique

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Geo
Member

From: Princeton, N.J.
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 02-22-2002 08:17 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Geo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Wow, great discoveries Dom. Very impressive work .

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oldgrognard
Member

From: Baltimore, MD
Registered: Nov 2001

posted 02-22-2002 08:27 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for oldgrognard     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I stand in awe of you fellows who really know something. Keep up the good work so we useless strap-hangers can reap the benefits.

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Alatriste
Member

From: Madrid (Spain)
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 02-22-2002 08:31 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Alatriste     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Executable: The last frontier. Mission: to boldly go where no one has gone before...

Great work, DOM.

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gentofthesouth1861
Member

From: Irving, Texas U.S.A.
Registered: Sep 2001

posted 02-22-2002 08:35 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for gentofthesouth1861     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
All I can say is: thank God you code wizards are doing this, and posting the goodies, for free. Otherwise I would go broke! Thanks again, and great work. Mike.

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Andy
Member

From: Jena, Germany
Registered: Jun 2001

posted 02-22-2002 08:52 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Andy     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
DOM, you're the man!!! Great work.

I didn't work on them cause I first wanted to finish the skin I released yesterday.

When I read your last post on the topic I had similar things in mind. That means, that every chunk is used for one slot... So this seems to be true. Please inform us about all knowledge you ware able to get from these bytes.
I'm especially proud of you because of the random formation finding. This is exactly what we need for a nightfighter campaign. I can't tell it often enough: Great work.

Now the question is: should I still take care of them or do you now know all we need to know?

Greetings,
Andy.

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Pobs
Member

From: North Wales, UK
Registered: Jun 2001

posted 02-22-2002 09:03 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Pobs     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Dom,

excellent, now we can have night bomber missions with small open formations!!!

well done indeed!!

S!

cheers,


Pobs

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Emil
Member

From: Belgium
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 02-22-2002 09:18 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Emil     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Great DOM! Please continue your VERY valuable work for all EAW enthousiasts!

I didn't try your skin randomiser yet, because I'm so busy with all these campaigns (right now Malta). But a combined "Skin-Formation Randomiser" would be terrific and I'd certainly use it if I'm ever going to PLAY a campaign in the future!

------------------
'Alles zu retten muss alles gewagt werden' - Schiller

Emil's EAW Campaigns

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BFawlty
Member

From: Flagstaff Arizona, USA
Registered: May 2001

posted 02-22-2002 09:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for BFawlty     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Man you guys are awesome. This game has come so far it's hard to remember where or what it started as. Thanks

BF

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Nicholas Bell
Member

From: Gwynedd Valley, PA
Registered: Jul 2001

posted 02-22-2002 09:58 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Nicholas Bell     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Has anyone determined how to change the altitude of flights? The 8AF bomber missions are never at the 22-27,000' altitude they usually flew at, but are usually below 20,000'

Wondering if this might be in the same region as the formation size code Dom is exploring.

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DOM
Member

From: Lille, France
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 02-22-2002 10:03 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for DOM     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

Andy,

Don't worry. As I said, last week-end I didn't see the opportunity to do some EAW job untill a week or more and I thus begged some valuable help. Many thanks to you and Moggy for your proposal. I got unexpected spare time during the week : that's why !
The reason why I posted the present message is that I don't want anyone having read my previous post and doing work which is already done . Well, I plan to do some extra job on this stuff on Sunday and I hope to yield enough infos in order to build the tool (following Sunday ?).

About the slots : probably, I made my explanations unclear. Among the 15 bytes series, only 10 are used. Don't ask me why, I don't know. That means that a single series may affect one, two or up to (10?) slots. I remember (I have not my notes here)that the single series #11 (12?) affect many german a/c slots like 109E, 109G, 109K, 190A, 190D, JU88A, Me410, 262 (german fighters or so). Series #5 only affects slot B26. Hence, the changes made for slot 109E will also affect 109G, 109K, 190A ... Since the settings could be changed everytime the patch program will be launched, this will not a big prob IMO.

I will communicate my findings as soon as possible and your advices will be welcome to build the randomizing tool.

Dominique

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DOM
Member

From: Lille, France
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 02-22-2002 10:07 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for DOM     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

Of course, and as said, valuable changes could be made in the night missions patch. Here too, your advices are welcome.

Dominique

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DOM
Member

From: Lille, France
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 02-22-2002 10:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for DOM     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

N Bell : there are not in the immediate vicinity of those bytes but ... probably somewhere


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dancho
Member

From: USA
Registered: Oct 1999

posted 02-22-2002 10:57 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for dancho     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Dom has assured his place in the EAW Hall of Fame.

------------------
dancho's EAW Paint Barn

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Alatriste
Member

From: Madrid (Spain)
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 02-22-2002 12:18 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Alatriste     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Apart from night missions, we have an use for this in the spanish campaign: now we can force everyone save the germans to fly in vics and closed formations.

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BP51
Member

From: USA
Registered: Mar 2001

posted 02-22-2002 12:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BP51     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Great !!This is just what i was hoping for ,many thanks Dom

------------------
"If i lose all my money i don't care.If i die i don't mind,just as long as i'm reincarnated as a girl's bicycle seat"-Keith Moon

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Moggy
Member

From: A slit trench near RAF Gravesend
Registered: Aug 2000

posted 02-22-2002 01:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moggy     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Sorry DOM,

I've been engaged in shadows and cockpits, and was going to have a look at those bytes this weekend. At least we've gotsome good pointers now as to how formations are controlled. Excellent work!

Moggy

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Steve T
Member

From: The Heart of England
Registered: Jan 2002

posted 02-22-2002 03:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Steve T     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
S! DOM,

and Alatriste, I like your thinking with reference to the SCW formations

Steve T

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Bingo47
Member

From: Toulouse,France
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 02-23-2002 11:28 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bingo47     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
DOM,
Following your recherches on EAW.EXE version 1.2a,I modified bytes 3 in serie 1
(B17 & B24).
I put "04" three times.(The maximum)
(No extra squads.Normal setting only).
I got:
-interception mission:
ex 1:12 Fw190D,72 (8 boxes of 9 planes) B17,32 (2 flights of 16 planes) P51D.
ex 2:12 Bf109K,32 Fw190D,72 B24,32 P51D.
-escort mission:
ex 1:36 B17,12 P38J,8 Fw190A.
ex 2:36 B24,12 P38J,12 Fw190A.
Number of escort fighters seems in rapport with the number of bomber (?)
Never got 72 bombers in escort.(No superposition of planes in bombers formation).

Interesting:in bombers formation all "nose art" are used (17 for B17 & 15 for B24).
Usualy only 12 for a formation of 36 planes are used.With extra squads when we got
72 bombers (2 flights of 36 planes)or more (about one hundred) the second and evantually third flights use the same "nose art" than the first flight.Nose art on plane 1,4,7,10,13,16,19,22,25,28,31,34 and now 37,40,43,46,49 (17 nose art used),52 (same as plane 1),55 (same as plane2),58,61,64,67,70.

Bingo47.

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Bingo47
Member

From: Toulouse,France
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 02-23-2002 02:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bingo47     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Do the same for serie 5 (B26)
Got:
-interception:12 Bf11OG,32 Me410,32 P47C and
128 B26!!!!!!
-escort:64 B26,12 P51B,12 109.

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Gramps
Member

From: Munda
Registered: Nov 2001

posted 02-23-2002 02:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gramps     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'd just like to add my thanks to all you code-breakers! Who said you need an Enigma machine?

Well done!

Gramps
VMF214

PS Yes, DOM does deserve to be in the EAW Hall of Fame!

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